Spain Mastery · Lesson 10
Cava and Spanish Sparkling Wine: From Industrial Bubbles to World-Class Traditional Method
Learning Objectives
- →Explain the origin of Cava (when it began, who invented it, and why the name changed in 1970) and use this history to build credibility and guest curiosity on the floor
- →Describe the three traditional Cava grape varieties (Macabeu, Xarel·lo, Parellada), explain each one's structural contribution to the blend, and explain how Xarel·lo-dominant and Chardonnay-forward Cavas differ in style
- →Identify all four Cava quality tiers (standard Cava, Reserva, Gran Reserva, and Cava de Paraje Calificado), state their minimum lees-aging requirements, and articulate what distinguishes Gran Reserva and Paraje Calificado from standard commercial production
- →Explain what Corpinnat is, why a group of top Catalan producers left the Cava DO in 2019, and what the Corpinnat rules require, and translate this story into a floor conversation that excites a knowledgeable guest
- →Describe the key estates (Recaredo, Gramona, Raventós i Blanc, Freixenet, and Codorníu) with enough producer-specific detail to make personalized recommendations across all price points
- →Execute a confident floor strategy for selling Cava and Spanish sparkling wine: the value pitch, the Champagne alternative conversation, the Corpinnat differentiation story, and correct service temperature, glassware, and pairing guidance
Cava, History and the Champagne Question
The story of Cava begins with a single journey. In 1872, Josep Raventós (scion of the Codorníu estate in the Penedès region of Catalonia) returned from a visit to Champagne with a methodology, a conviction, and a plan. He had observed the traditional method of secondary fermentation in the bottle, and he believed it could be applied to the indigenous grape varieties of his home region. That year, he produced Spain's first traditional-method sparkling wine at the family estate. The bottle he held was not called Cava. It was not called anything formal at all. But the category had been born.
Over the following decades, the Catalan sparkling wine industry expanded with remarkable speed. Freixenet, founded in 1914 by the Sala and Ferrer families, became Codorníu's great rival, and the two houses would go on to become the two largest producers of traditional-method sparkling wine in the world (larger by volume, at their commercial peak, than any Champagne house. By the mid-20th century, Spanish sparkling wine was being called "Champán" by Spanish speakers and "Xampany" in Catalan) a direct borrowing of the Champagne name that set the stage for one of wine law's most consequential naming disputes.
The renaming came in 1970. As France pressed for international protection of the "Champagne" appellation (a process that would eventually lead to Europe-wide prohibition on the use of the name for any wine made outside the Champagne region of France) the Spanish industry was forced to find a new identity. The word chosen was "Cava," derived from the Catalan word for a wine cellar or cave (the underground chambers where riddling and aging traditionally took place). The name was practical and evocative, and it stuck. In 1986, with Spain's entry into the European Community, the Cava DO was formally established with its distinctive structure.
That structure is the first unusual thing a professional should understand about Cava: it is not a geographic appellation. Every other Spanish DO defines a bounded region, a map you can draw, a territory you can walk. Cava's DO defines a production method. The traditional method (secondary fermentation in bottle, minimum lees aging, riddling, and disgorgement) is the qualification, not the address. As a result, Cava can technically be produced across Spain, in Rioja, in Extremadura, in Aragon, though the practical reality is that approximately 95% of all Cava is made in the Penedès region of Catalonia, specifically in the area around the town of Sant Sadurní d'Anoia, which functions as the spiritual and commercial capital of Spanish sparkling wine.
That geographic concentration matters because it links Cava to a specific combination of soils, climate, and indigenous varieties that give the wine its character. The Penedès sits between Barcelona and Tarragona, a mix of limestone and chalk soils at varying altitudes, low coastal zones for the heat-tolerant Xarel·lo, mid-elevations for the structural Macabeu, and higher limestone plateaus for the delicate Parellada. The Mediterranean climate delivers warmth and sunshine moderated by altitude; the Montserrat mountains to the north provide a barrier against cold northern air. It is not Champagne (the latitude is lower, the summers are warmer, the grapes ripen more fully) and Cava should not try to be. Its distinctiveness is its asset.
The reputation challenge is real and must be addressed honestly. At 250 million or more bottles per year, Cava is one of the highest-volume traditional-method sparkling wines in the world. Volume on that scale produces inconsistency. The same appellation that covers Recaredo's biodynamic, hand-riddled, single-vineyard masterworks also covers anonymous supermarket Cava aging for nine months before being sold for four dollars. That quality gulf is enormous, and it has damaged the category's perception among serious wine professionals. The quality tier revolution (the Cava DO's introduction of Gran Reserva and Cava de Paraje Calificado, and the parallel emergence of Corpinnat as a breakaway organization) is a direct, deliberate response to that reputational damage. Understanding this arc is essential to selling Cava at any level above basic.
Pro Tip: The founding story is a genuine hospitality asset. "This began as one Spanish winemaker going to Champagne in 1872 and coming home to make something different" is more interesting than any label description. Lead with the history for guests who seem engaged; lead with the value for guests who seem price-conscious. Both conversations close the same sale.
The Cava Grapes
Cava's character begins with its grape varieties, and those varieties are unlike anything in Champagne. Where Champagne's traditional trio of Chardonnay, Pinot Noir, and Pinot Meunier are global varieties grown in a cool northern climate, Cava's traditional trio, Macabeu, Xarel·lo, and Parellada, are indigenous Catalan varieties found almost nowhere else in the world at serious commercial scale. Understanding each one, its personality, and its role in the blend is the foundation of serious Cava literacy.
Macabeu (Viura)
Macabeu is the workhorse of the traditional Cava blend and historically the most widely planted Cava variety. It is the same grape known as Viura in Rioja, where it produces still white wines of moderate aromatic intensity and fresh acidity. In Cava, Macabeu provides the structural backbone: its moderate-to-fresh acidity gives sparklers their spine, its relatively neutral aromatic profile allows the other varieties and the lees aging to shape the wine's character, and its broad production allows the blender to achieve volume and consistency. Macabeu-dominant Cava tends toward citrus and green apple on the nose, with clean, fresh mid-palate and moderate length. It is not a complex grape on its own, but it is a reliable, generous partner.
Xarel·lo
Xarel·lo (pronounced "sha-REL-lo") is the most distinctive and, in the hands of serious producers, the most important Cava variety. It is firmly Catalan, grown almost exclusively in Penedès, and its character is unlike anything in the international sparkling wine canon. Xarel·lo brings weight, body, and a texture that runs from waxy to almost oily in ripe years, a fullness that gives serious Cava its palate presence and distinctiveness. Its flavor profile tends toward earth, yellow apple, fennel, and a savory, almost bread-crust quality that integrates beautifully with extended lees contact. Most importantly, Xarel·lo has extraordinary aging potential. The oxidative handling capacity of its skin phenolics and the structural weight of its body allow Xarel·lo-dominant wines to develop complexity over years and even decades in the bottle. When you encounter a Gran Reserva Cava with real depth and complexity, the kind that competes with aged vintage Champagne, Xarel·lo is usually the reason.
Parellada
Parellada is the lightest, most delicate, and most aromatic of the traditional Cava trio. It is grown at higher altitudes than Macabeu or Xarel·lo (the cooler temperatures slow ripening and preserve freshness) and it contributes floral aromatics, citrus, and delicate stone fruit to the blend. Parellada ripens later than the other varieties and is particularly sensitive to heat; its finest expressions come from elevations where summer nights remain cool and the harvest can be delayed to build aromatic complexity without sacrificing acidity. In the blend, Parellada is the perfume, the lightness, the elegant finish. Too much Parellada without the weight of Xarel·lo can make a wine feel thin; properly proportioned, it is an essential contributor.
Chardonnay and International Varieties
Chardonnay was permitted in Cava production in 1986, coinciding with Spain's European Community entry, and its use has expanded significantly among premium producers. Chardonnay contributes the same things in Cava that it contributes in Champagne: freshness, clean citrus aromatics, and the richness and breadth of body that comes from barrel fermentation or lees aging. Many of the top Corpinnat producers use Chardonnay extensively; it adds an internationally recognizable freshness and appeal alongside the more idiosyncratic Xarel·lo. Pinot Noir and Garnacha are permitted for rosé Cava production, contributing the red fruit aromatics and color that define that style.
Reading the Blend
The blend ratio is the key to understanding a Cava's style. Xarel·lo-dominant blends, common among serious artisanal producers, offer more body, more earth, more aging potential. Parellada-heavy blends lean toward fresh, floral, delicate styles for early drinking. Chardonnay-forward blends tend toward clean, citrus-bright, internationally approachable styles. On the floor, knowing this allows you to match a Cava to a guest's stated preference: "You like something rich and complex? This is Xarel·lo-dominant and has been aging for four years. You like something fresh and elegant? This one leads with Parellada and Chardonnay."
Pro Tip: Xarel·lo is one of the best conversation-starters in Spanish wine. It's genuinely obscure, most guests have never heard of it, but once you explain "earthy, waxy, extraordinary aging potential, found almost nowhere outside Catalonia," it becomes a discovery. Guests who feel they've learned something become advocates. "I had this Catalan grape I'd never heard of and it was incredible" is exactly the kind of table conversation that brings a guest back.
The Cava Quality Tiers
The Cava DO's quality tier system is its most important structural reform, the mechanism by which the appellation has attempted to separate its artisanal top end from the anonymous commercial volume that dominates by numbers. Understanding these tiers is essential to navigating any wine list and to making credible Cava recommendations.
Standard Cava: Minimum 9 Months on Lees
The baseline category. After secondary fermentation in bottle and disgorgement, a standard Cava must spend a minimum of 9 months aging on its lees, the spent yeast cells that impart the characteristic bready, toasty complexity associated with traditional-method sparkling wine. Nine months is the minimum; it is also, for volume producers working at scale, usually the actual time spent. The result is fresh, clean, citrus-forward sparkling wine with modest lees influence and a youthful character. This is the category that fills supermarket shelves and drives the volume numbers. It is not where quality conversation lives, but it is not without merit for casual by-the-glass service.
Cava Reserva: Minimum 15 Months on Lees
An intermediate tier requiring 50% more time on lees than standard Cava. The additional months develop more pronounced yeast influence, bread dough, brioche, subtle nuttiness, and begin to integrate the base wine's fruit character more fully. Cava Reserva represents a meaningful quality step for producers serious about this tier, and the best examples offer genuine complexity at an accessible price point. For a sommelier building a by-the-glass Cava program, Reserva is usually the minimum tier worth featuring.
Cava Gran Reserva: Minimum 30 Months on Lees
Gran Reserva is where serious Cava lives. The requirements are specific and demanding: minimum 30 months aging on lees, vintage-dated (non-vintage wines are not permitted at this tier), and dosage restricted to Brut or drier: Brut Nature (0–3 g/L residual sugar), Extra Brut (0–6 g/L), or Brut (0–12 g/L). The minimum of 2.5 years of contact with the yeast lees produces wines with profound complexity, deep toast, brioche, hazelnut, preserved lemon, and the oxidative notes (dried apricot, honeyed richness) that develop with extended aging. Gran Reserva Cavas from serious producers are among the most compelling traditional-method sparkling wines in the world at any price, and they typically retail for a fraction of comparable vintage Champagne.
The vintage requirement is significant: Gran Reserva Cava tells you a specific year, a specific growing season, a specific set of conditions that shaped the wine's character. This gives sommeliers a vocabulary: "This is from 2018, which was warm in Penedès with a long growing season, the Xarel·lo has extraordinary richness." That kind of seasonal specificity elevates the conversation from category to wine.
Cava de Paraje Calificado: The Grand Cru Tier
Introduced in 2017, Cava de Paraje Calificado is the appellation's answer to the question: "What would a grand cru Cava look like?" The requirements are the most demanding in the DO:
- Minimum 36 months aging on lees (and in practice, most serious Paraje wines age considerably longer)
- Manual riddling (gyropalettes prohibited, the wine must be turned by hand, the traditional riddler's craft)
- Estate-bottled from a single, geographically defined, named parcel (paraje)
- Organic or sustainable farming required
- Vintage-dated
- Must represent a specific terroir, the paraje must be delimited and approved
The result is Cava that functions conceptually like Burgundy Grand Cru or Champagne Blanc de Blancs from a specific lieu-dit: a named vineyard, a specific place, a wine that exists nowhere else. Paraje Calificado wines are inherently small-production, inherently artisanal, and priced accordingly. They are the Cava a serious wine guest has almost certainly never encountered, which is precisely their value on a fine dining list.
Reading a Cava Label
A complete Cava label communicates: the producer (bodega name), the tier (Reserva, Gran Reserva, Paraje Calificado or absence of designation for standard), the vintage (required for Gran Reserva and Paraje), and the dosage level (Brut Nature, Brut, Extra Seco, Seco, Semi-Seco, Dulce). For Gran Reserva and Paraje wines, additional information often includes the base grape blend, the specific parcel name, and the disgorgement date.
Pro Tip: The Gran Reserva value story is one of the strongest in all of wine. "This wine spent 30 months aging on its lees before release, longer than many vintage Champagnes, and it costs $35 retail." That comparison doesn't undercut Champagne; it creates context. Guests who already love Champagne hear this and lean in. Guests who feel Champagne is out of reach hear this and feel discovered. Both guests order the bottle.
Corpinnat, The Breakaway
In 2019, a group of Cava's most respected and exacting producers did something unprecedented in modern wine politics: they left. They walked away from the Cava DO (the appellation their families had helped build, in some cases the appellation whose name they had literally invented) and formed their own organization with their own, stricter rules. They called it Corpinnat.
The grievance was specific and legitimate: the Cava DO's structure allowed the same appellation name, "Cava", to appear on both Recaredo's hand-harvested, biodynamic, single-vineyard, years-aged masterwork and the anonymous industrial product in the supermarket four-pack. From the producers' perspective, this was not a quality spectrum; it was a quality fraud. Consumers who encountered bargain Cava and found it unremarkable had no way to know that an entirely different product existed within the same appellation. The DO's brand equity was being steadily destroyed by volume at the expense of quality.
Corpinnat's founding rules address every element of that grievance:
- Geographic restriction: Corpinnat wines must come from the Penedès, the historic heartland of Cava production. The broader Cava DO's allowance of production from across Spain is explicitly rejected. Penedès only.
- Organic farming: All member estates must farm organically. This is non-negotiable and verifiable.
- Estate-grown grapes: No purchasing of grapes from outside sources. All grapes must come from vineyards owned or under long-term lease by the producer. This ties the wine irrevocably to a specific place.
- Hand harvest: Mechanical harvesting is prohibited. All grapes are hand-picked.
- Minimum 18 months aging: A longer minimum than standard Cava's 9 months, though most Corpinnat members age their wines far beyond this floor.
- No industrial producers: The founding members explicitly excluded large-volume industrial houses. Corpinnat is a small-producer, artisanal organization.
The most important thing to understand about Corpinnat labels: they will not say "Cava." A Corpinnat wine will say "Corpinnat" on the label, or may be labeled as "Penedès Espumoso" (sparkling wine from Penedès). The Cava name has been deliberately left behind. This means that guests looking for "Cava" will not find Corpinnat wines in that mental category, and guests who encounter a Corpinnat wine on a list may not know what they are looking at.
That confusion is an opportunity. When a guest sees "Corpinnat" and asks what it is, you have the best possible platform: "These are the producers who helped create Cava and then left the appellation because they thought the standards weren't strict enough. Their rules are stricter than Champagne's in some ways. This is what the founders thought Cava should always have been."
Founding Members
The Corpinnat founding group includes Gramona, Llopart, Nadal, Recaredo, Sabaté i Coca, and Torelló. Each brings decades of artisanal production history.
Pro Tip: The Corpinnat story has exactly the structure that makes wine guests remember a conversation: conflict, principles, and consequence. "The producers who helped invent Cava left the appellation because they thought the standards were too low" is the kind of sentence that makes someone put down their phone. Tell it that way. The guest who walks out of your restaurant saying "I had a Corpinnat", probably for the first time, is a guest who comes back specifically because of you.
Key Producers
Recaredo: The Reference Estate
Recaredo, based in Sant Sadurní d'Anoia, is the standard against which all serious Cava and Corpinnat is measured. The estate is biodynamic, has been for years, and produces wines of extraordinary precision and longevity from estate-owned vineyards in the Penedès. Their approach is uncompromising: hand riddling on traditional pupitres, no dosage (most of their wines are Brut Nature), and aging periods that extend far beyond any regulatory minimum.
Their entry-level wine, Terrers, is already exceptional by any international sparkling wine standard, a blend of Xarel·lo, Macabeu, and Parellada from multiple estate parcels, aged far beyond the minimum, showing the earthy, textural complexity that defines great Cava. But the pinnacle is Turó d'en Mota: a single-vineyard wine from a specific parcel of ancient Xarel·lo vines, vintage-dated, hand-riddled, Brut Nature, aged for a minimum of seven years on lees. It is one of Spain's greatest wines in any category, a sparkling wine with the weight, complexity, and terroir expression of a great white Burgundy, built from a grape variety that most of the world has never heard of.
Gramona: Decades on Lees
Gramona is Corpinnat's most extreme practitioner of extended lees aging. Their flagship wines push lees contact to lengths that have no parallel outside the category: III Lustros Gran Reserva ages for a minimum of roughly seven years (over 80 months) on lees before disgorgement. The name (III Lustros, three lustrums or fifteen years) is symbolic of the family's philosophy and heritage rather than the guaranteed lees-aging time. The result is a wine of extraordinary oxidative complexity: deep gold in color, with aromas of dried apricot, hazelnut, preserved lemon, buttered toast, and an almost Sherry-like oxidative richness layered over the structural precision of Xarel·lo. It is sui generis, nothing else quite like it exists.
Their Argent Blanc de Blancs (100% Xarel·lo) demonstrates the variety's power in isolation: waxy, structured, earthy, with astonishing depth for a sparkling wine. Gramona is a Corpinnat founding member and among the most consistent advocates for the category's highest ambitions.
Raventós i Blanc: History and Precision
Raventós i Blanc occupies a position of singular historical weight: the estate is run by the direct descendants of Josep Raventós, who made Spain's first traditional-method sparkling wine in 1872. In 2012, the family made the formal decision to leave the Cava DO and build something stricter, championing their own Conca del Riu Anoia project rather than joining Corpinnat.
Their flagship L'Hereu is the estate wine: a blend of Macabeu, Xarel·lo, and Parellada from estate vineyards in Conca del Riu Anoia, the family's historic home valley. It is clean, precise, elegant, and accessible (a perfect introduction to the Raventós philosophy. Manuel Raventós Negra is their rosé flagship) a blend including Monastrell and other red varieties, showing the depth of color and red fruit character that great rosé Cava can achieve.
Freixenet and Codorníu: Understanding Scale
Freixenet and Codorníu are the industrial giants of Cava production, together accounting for a vast proportion of global Cava volume. Their standard-tier wines (the iconic Freixenet Cordon Negro in its black bottle, the basic Codorníu ranges) are not where quality conversation belongs, and attempting to position them alongside Gramona or Recaredo would be a mistake.
However, both houses produce premium tiers that deserve attention. Freixenet's Elyssia range and Codorníu's Anna de Codorníu are intentionally positioned as quality expressions, longer lees aging, better fruit selection, more attention to blend. These are wines that belong in a mid-tier sparkling program, offered as house pours or by-the-glass options at price-conscious establishments. Knowing the distinction (that the brand has a premium tier that operates on different standards than the flagship commercial product) allows a floor professional to make an honest recommendation when these producers appear on a list.
AT Roca: Artisanal Reserve Depth
AT Roca (founded in 2013 by Agustí Torelló Roca of the Agustí Torelló Mata winemaking family) is a serious artisanal producer focusing on aged reserve wines with genuine complexity. Their wines represent the mid-tier artisanal category between the volume producers and the Corpinnat estates, still within the Cava DO, working at extended aging, producing wines with real depth and regional character. For wine programs that want a quality presence without the price point of Recaredo or Gramona, AT Roca fills the gap credibly.
Pro Tip: Having one Corpinnat wine and one Cava DO Gran Reserva on a list gives you two separate conversations. The Corpinnat is the story (use it for guests who engage with narrative. The Gran Reserva is the value) use it for the table that wants quality at a price. Both conversations end at the same place: a guest who understands that Spanish sparkling wine is not what they thought it was.
Floor Strategy, Selling Cava and Spanish Sparkling
The Value Pitch
The foundational Cava conversation is the value pitch, and it should be deployed without apology: "Gran Reserva Cava offers Champagne-level complexity at roughly a third of the price." This is not an overstatement, it is an accurate description of what the best Gran Reserva Cava represents. A 30-month minimum on lees, vintage-dated, Brut Nature or Brut only: that is a wine made with more care and more time than most non-vintage Champagne, and it is priced accordingly because the Cava name does not carry Champagne's luxury premium.
The guest who responds positively to this pitch is already sold. The guest who pushes back, "But Champagne is Champagne", deserves a more nuanced response: "Absolutely. Champagne is its own thing and there's nothing exactly like it. But if you're looking for the same traditional method, the same lees aging process, the same bubbles in the glass, and you want to explore something genuinely different from a set of grape varieties you've never tasted before, Cava at this tier is one of the best arguments in the wine world." That answer respects both the category and the guest's loyalty to Champagne.
The Champagne Alternative
The Champagne alternative conversation is not "instead of Champagne", it is "in addition to." When a table wants sparkling wine for celebration and the Champagne they'd want is at a price point that feels aggressive, the Cava alternative allows you to serve the moment beautifully without asking the guest to make a sacrifice. The key is framing: "This is what I reach for when I want traditional-method sparkling wine and I want to discover something. It's not trying to be Champagne, it's something Catalonia does that no one else does."
The Recaredo/Gramona Explanation
The standard Cava objection from a wine-knowledgeable guest is: "I've had Cava. It's fine but it's not serious." The answer to this objection is Recaredo or Gramona, and the answer should be specific: "Recaredo is biodynamic, they hand-riddle every bottle, and their top wine is on lees for seven or more years before it's released, longer than vintage Champagne. Gramona ages their III Lustros for roughly seven years on lees. These are not the Cava you've had before. They're wines that have spent more time in the producer's cellar than some wines spend in existence."
That answer changes the frame completely. The guest who was dismissing Cava as a category is now encountering specific wines with specific credentials that challenge their assumption. That is the most productive conversation in wine service.
Corpinnat as Differentiation
For guests who know wine (who follow producers, who read wine press, who travel to regions) Corpinnat is a genuine discovery. Most guests who know Rioja, Ribera del Duero, and even Priorat have not encountered Corpinnat. The story, producers leaving a DO to build something stricter, is immediately interesting to anyone who cares about wine politics and quality. Use it: "These producers left the Cava appellation in 2019 because they thought the standards weren't strict enough. Now their wines say Corpinnat instead of Cava. This is what the people who helped invent the category thought it should always have been."
Service Protocol
Cava should be served at the same temperature as Champagne: 7–9°C (45–48°F). Warmer than this and the bubbles become aggressive and the wine loses precision; colder than this and the aromatics close down. An ice bucket with water and ice for the first 20 minutes of service, then removing the bottle to allow it to climb slightly toward 9°C as the meal progresses, is the correct approach.
Glassware: a tulip-shaped flute or, better, a standard white wine glass. The flute concentrates the bubbles visually but restricts aromatics; a white wine glass allows the Xarel·lo's earthy complexity and the lees character to fully express. For Gran Reserva and Paraje wines (wines that have aged for years and deserve full aromatic expression) the white wine glass is the clear choice.
Service: open with the same care as Champagne. Twist the bottle rather than the cork. A gentle, controlled release, not a pop. A whisper, not an explosion.
Food Pairing
Standard and Reserva Cava: the natural pairing is tapas. This is not a cliché, it is a genuine affinity rooted in regional cuisine and wine chemistry. Acidity cuts through fat and salt; small bites complement the wine's relatively light structure. Patatas bravas, jamón ibérico, gambas al ajillo, croquetas, boquerones: all are improved by a glass of clean, fresh Cava alongside.
Gran Reserva Cava: the weight and oxidative complexity of extended-lees wines open the pairing range considerably. Roast chicken with herbs, lightly sauced white fish, aged manchego, mushroom risotto, white-truffle preparations, these dishes need the wine's breadth. A Gran Reserva Cava can handle dishes that would overwhelm a standard sparkler.
Corpinnat and Paraje Calificado: treat these as you would aged vintage Champagne or serious white Burgundy. The food deserves to match the wine's seriousness. Poached lobster, scallop crudo, Dover sole, and aged sheep's-milk cheese are appropriate reference points.
Pro Tip: The tapas pairing is the easiest hospitality move in this category: "Shall we start with a glass of Cava? It was made for exactly this kind of food." That sentence requires no wine knowledge from the guest, requires no explanation of Corpinnat or Xarel·lo, and opens the meal with a moment of generosity and confidence. Start there. Build up. Save the Gramona story for the guest who leans in and asks, "Tell me more."